MyDD :: Pres. Debates

Pres. Debates

by Jerome Armstrong, Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 05:52:12 AM EST

The chances of there being any Summer debates between Obama and McCain are fleeting. Instead, we are likely only to get the standard offering:

The Commission on Presidential Debates proposed last week the less formal, more conversational talk-show format for two of three 90-minute debates it's seeking this fall. The third debate would be a town hall-style session in which the candidates would be free to walk around the stage.

The proposed debates are:

* Sept. 26 at the University of Mississippi in Oxford, Miss.

* Oct. 7 at Belmont University in Nashville, Tenn., the town hall session.

* Oct. 15 at Hofstra University in Hempstead, N.Y.

The proposed vice presidential debate:

* Oct. 2 at Washington University in St. Louis.

My guess is that these will stick. Bush, in 2000, tried to re-negotiate the debates before they happened, and wound up giving Gore traction with the effort. With Obama, it might be different, as he's already been keeping McCain at length over town halls, but the media wouldn't give the leverage with the Commissioned debates that they have with the ad hoc ones.

I've been reading "A Glorious Disaster", which recounts the 1964 Goldwater vs Johnson election. There are some interesting symbolic parallels with '08 in the book. Another 'Barry' as candidate, a Senator from Arizona (McCain's is the top quote on the back cover), small donor records with massive crowds, for instance, but in substance, its not a similar election. As far as debates go though, LBJ wouldn't give an inch. They never happened.

The article suggests that the debate style would favor McCain, because they'd both be seated, but I don't know if that's the case. Obama, in the moments I recall from his nomination debates, had his toughest moments when he was taking questions from the podium. I don't recall McCain's moments in comparison, but it does at times look like the podium engulfs McCain. They probably both benefit from being seated.

And howabout the locations? NY is not a surprise, neither is the St. Louis location, but Nashville TN and Oxford MS are new on the map for debates. TN is not going to be competitive, but Obama is probably pleased about the MS selection.

Also of note from the article:

Of the states Kerry won in 2004, Obama campaign manager David Plouffe said the closest this year may be Michigan, Pennsylvania and New Hampshire.

And it's probably a pretty wide gulf between those and the next tier of states.

Tags: 2008 election (all tags)

Permalink :: 27 Comments :: Post a Comment

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

Not happy about the TN location. It would have been better if something was done out in the west. Like in New Mexico.

by Makey on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 05:56:08 AM EST

Especially the townhall in Tennessee? (none / 0)

Shouldn't the townhall be in a swing state.

Still puzzled about no debates in the West or Mid-west.

Who decides these locations?

by puma on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 07:56:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Why are 2 out of the 3 debates (none / 0)

in the South? That doesn't make any sense.

Perhaps the locations can be negotiated. The Obama campaign can say that let's do one of the debates in the West or the Mid-west.

by puma on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 07:53:50 AM EST

In terms of sitting vs standing (2.00 / 1)

I actually think that Obama does FAR BETTER in debates when he is sitting. Some of his WORST debate moments happened when he was standing (remember the last ABC one?).

Obama while standing kind of lectures and stumbles on his own words. Obama while sitting becomes conversational and thoughtful. Obama always comes across as extremely intelligent and reasonable when he does a more conversational interview (check out the latest FOX News business interview) or debate.

Standing debates is more about "soundbites" which Obama really isn't that great at. Sitting debates are more about conversation which is what Obama does very well at.

Lucky for Obama the conventional wisdom is that Obama isn't very good at debates thus expectations for him will be low. McCain has higher expectation that he will do well. In the coming debates Obama will be the underdog which is a great position to be.

by puma on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:07:38 AM EST

Re: In terms of sitting vs standing (2.00 / 1)

Hadn't really thought about that but you are right. I think his best performance was the sit-down February NBC debate in Ohio.

by conspiracy on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 09:48:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I agree 100 percent (2.00 / 1)

He is more relaxed in that setting.

John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."

by desmoinesdem on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 10:32:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

Wow, in this big country, St. Louis, Nashville, and Oxford are really quite close to each other. I wonder if the commission chair lives somewhere in between :)

by JoeFelice on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:08:03 AM EST

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

I thought the Dems would push more for Western state debates. Wasn't Dean's strategy to lock the western swing states?

by devoted1 on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:11:16 AM EST

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

I thought the Dems would push more for Western state debates. Wasn't Dean's strategy to lock the western swing states?

by devoted1 on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:11:59 AM EST

Re: Pres. Debates Locations (none / 0)

I have no certain knowledge, but I'm wondering how much location has to do with TV broadcast times . . .

1992 debates were in St. Louis, Richmond, East Lansing

Hartford, SAN DIEGO, St. Petersburg
Boston, Winston-Salem, St Louis
Coral Gables, St, Louis, Cleveland

Except for San Diego, Easten and Central time zones have them all . . .

Just speculating

"If you don't care about everybody, you don't care about anybody." --Ethan Mordden

by prodigal on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:57:03 AM EST

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

I think that one of the debates should have been in New Orleans. It would have had great symbolic value. And I agree with you all who are saying that the townhall one shouldn't be in Tennesse. Tennesse is not a swing state, which means that if Barack Obama gets most of the swing or leaning voters who ask questions, he probaby still won't win the state. It would have made more sense for the town hall to be in a western or mountain state.

I also agree that sitting down benefits both candidates. If Obama is going to be the underdog at the debates, it will only be at the town hall meeting, as that is where McCain is supposed to be the strongest, not necessarily where Obama is the weakest.

by Jaxx Raxor on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:59:57 AM EST

As a litigator (2.00 / 4)

who has been in all sorts of hearings, and as a former championship debater in college, I can tell you this:

The less formal the setting, the more important likabiity is. If the two candidates are seated at a table, Barak will have an advantage because he comes across as likable, while McCain can seem touchy. It is also much tougher to go negative in more informal setting.

I have spent significant pro-bono work before a variety of administrative panels. In a couple of settings the hearing room is small and we share the same large table. As a defense attorney who has to be very agressive with state officials, I have grown to HATE small intimate rooms because a touch direct line of questioning appears rude and impolite. The same line of questioning will appear far less impolite in a large courtroom where the witness is on the stand.

by fladem on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 09:54:17 AM EST

Re: Pres. Debates (2.00 / 1)

I think the geography is kind of irrelevant nowadays. The way the cable news companies handle these debates you could be in the middle of Antartica and it would still feel like anywhere USA.

The only potential differences may be crowd enthusiasm and the type of questions asked. Let's be realistic though, I can't think of any state where McCain has such an incredible enthusiasm gap that the crowd response would hurt Obama. Also, even the most partisan pro-Republican questions are nothing more than openings for Obama to rail against things most of the country are very scarred of, more war, a sour econonomy, and immigration come to mind.

On a final note, does anyone remember McCain in debates, he is no Hillary Clinton. McCain comes across as angry and bitter. Also Obama looked very raw in the early debates, but by the end was giving as good as he got. Let's keep eyes on the prize here, the debates will be Obama vs McCain, having watched both of them debate, Obama is gonna woop McCains butt with very little trouble. Aside from his growth as a debater, Obamas is on the "right" side of a lot of issues Americans are concerned about. If Obama or the moderators are halfway-smart, McCain will be spending half the time trying to explain his wavering on various issues in recent history, like immigration or energy policy.

by tlhwraith on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 09:56:53 AM EST

it's sad (2.00 / 1)

that height means anything in politics, but if it does, i believe it's a proxy for vigor, attractiveness, and charisma. I simply can't wait for the debates. 'my friend' mccain cannot compete on likability or on rhetoric, so he will have no choice but to attack nonstop. the american people love that.

[ Donate to Barack Obama ]

by semiquaver on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 10:17:36 AM EST

Re: it's sad (none / 0)

When they walk on stage and shake hands Barack should keep a tight grip and linger a little. That should give a good visual of the height difference for all to see.

by conspiracy on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 12:21:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: it's sad (none / 0)

Under debate plan, Obama loses height advantage

Obama is about 6 feet 1 inch tall; McCain is 5 feet 9. Candidates often try to use their heights to gain some sort of advantage in face-to-face debates, but it doesn't always work.

Al Gore wandered close to the shorter George W. Bush in 2000, who dismissed him with a shrug as if to say, "What are you doing over here?"

Does anyone have footage of this? I don't remember it, but it would be interesting to see.

[ Donate to Barack Obama ]

by semiquaver on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 01:55:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: it's sad (none / 0)

No, but I remember it clearly; Al Gore started walking over when Bush was in the middle of an answer. Bush stopped, feigned a double-take, said "uh, how ya doing?" and then kept answering.

The audience laughed. It was funny and the whole thing made me cringe.

by MeganLocke on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 03:25:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: it's sad (none / 0)

Yeah, that was one of the weirdest moments ever. For a split second, you actually thought Al Gore might take a swing at him.

"Tell me about your work ethic." "Well, I don't think ethnics do no work. I mean, that's they problem, really." "Overt racial prejudice. Impressive."

by vcalzone on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:09:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

I swear in one of the debates with McCain and Romney, McCain literally fell asleep while he was droning on about something in monotone... It was a sitting debate. they better make sure that McCain has had plenty of coffee...

It profits a PUMA nothing to give their soul for the whole world... but for McCain? --Sir Thomas More (if he were here now)

by LordMike on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 10:47:27 AM EST

Is MyDD THE place for the Puma faction (none / 0)

Have you checked out the super great anti-Obama, anti unity dairies that are on the recommend list.

Is this okay with you?

Especially considering that most of these folks are Republican trolls.

As the site fades into irrelevancy. But whatever. Free speech and all.

overthrow the government~participate

by missliberties on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 11:18:15 AM EST

2 out of 3 in the south (2.00 / 1)

is too much.
They need to move the Nashville debate out west, maybe Oregon.

by monkeyga on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 12:38:44 PM EST

Re: Pres. Debates (2.00 / 1)

Also know as the "John McCain looking dumber than a bag of hammers Debate"

Scy

by scytherius on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 01:48:34 PM EST

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

Personally, I wish Obama were more pro-democracy. I loved the idea of the town hall forums where the candidates would directly engage the electorate. That would be democracy in action.

by moevaughn on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 02:14:54 PM EST

Of course Obama like democracy (none / 0)

but the problem with this townhalls every week is that Obama needed the time to unite the base and flesh out his proposals as a candidate.

by puma on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 03:17:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

Silly. The first debate was proposed for the middle of June, i.e., right after Obama had finished running for the nomination. Obviously that's out of the question.

Because of the timing and what happened next, it wasn't meant to be accepted - the McCain campaign delivered a list of places and times to the Obama campaign with a 'yes or no' and accepted no counter-offers.

by MeganLocke on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 03:29:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Pres. Debates (none / 0)

Any debate between someone with intelligence and an idiot can be problematic...
Remember how the media jumped all over the Gore "sigh". Of course he was just reacting to the latest of stupid Dubya responses but that didn't matter..
I'm sure Obama will be coached
"It is ok to think McCain is an idiot..just don't show it."

SNL take...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7F4T6l0U cY

"harlequin speech of suicide, demanding instantaneous lobotomy"

by nogo postal on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:50:07 PM EST

Ahem (none / 0)

Nothing west of the Mississippi??? (Don't try to split hairs with St. Louis, Its on the Mississippi).

by NvDem on Mon Jun 30, 2008 at 02:05:29 AM EST

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